Definitely worth it. For many GPU-Grid would be the first worthwhile project to run on AMDs :)

The HD5850 has 18 shader clusters at 725 MHz. Cayman has at best 24 and OC'ed about 900 MHz. You could go higher with the clock (given enough voltage), but so could the HD5850.
That works out to be a factor of 24/18 * 900/725 = 1.65. So.. I must confess I underestimated the difference a bit. Let's agree to meet in the middle, shall we? ;)

MrS

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Scanning for our furry friends since Jan 2002

We agree that it's worth testing, and would be a worthwhile project.
As for performances, the speculation can end when we have Beta tasks :)

If you meant 'Cayman was 20% faster clock-for-clock' then you could add that factor into the equation, for a more agreeable middle-ground ;)

24/18 * 900/725 * 1.2 = 1.98.

- Almost forgot about Antilles, and all those mid range AMD cards with only single precision.

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No, that 20% comes from the fact that Cayman has 24 shader clusters compared 20 in a full Cypress. On the HD5850 2 of them are deactivated. That's where the first factor 24/18 comes from ;)

MrS

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You lost me at 20% faster per clock and 24/18 is 33%...
Anyway, I understand now :)

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me wrote:

20% at best

.. that's for a full Cypress (24/20), which the HD5850 is not ;)

MrS

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What can I say after two years of waiting to be able to count on ATI ...

This is my comment:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5P2jJdrz9bY

And on HD79xx in 48 seconds it is on target ...

:D

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Right, TomaszPawel, 'this calls for immediate discussion', this seems to be all that is happening on the ATI/AMD front...
'Nothing new in the east, west, north and south'?!
I am getting frustrated with waiting; right now I have an AMD Radeon HD 6990 and an ATI Radeon HD 5970, the former quite new, the latter sort of newish, but both ready to jump train, as soon as there might even be a beta app and work for it! So you so to say waste the power of four high-end GPUs...
Either give your volunteers a definitive date when there will be an app, and I mean definitive, or a definitive statement 'There will never be an ATI/AMD OpenCL app for the following reasons'! But please not this "sitting between two chairs" any longer!

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There is an app, and it will be beta tested when the scientists are in the position to do so, and have the time. The scientists built, tested (as well as previous unusable apps) and reported what they observed in this thread. Server upgrades and site improvements are presently being tested/developed. These are required for the project as a whole, and to facilitate the introduction and maintenance of an AMD app. When these are finished and implemented the scientists can then begin work on preparing to release an AMD Beta app.
I'm not in a position to give a definitive release date, and I cannot see how the researchers would be, until just before being ready. As for commitment to an AMD app, it's my understanding that the researchers have put off the release of a new NVidia app at least in part to help forward the release of an AMD app.

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Either give your volunteers a definitive date when there will be an app, and I mean definitive, or a definitive statement 'There will never be an ATI/AMD OpenCL app for the following reasons'! But please not this "sitting between two chairs" any longer!

Please tell me you're joking.

I'm not trying to start an argument here, but I really hope that you - a VOLUNTEER - are not making demands of the GPUGRID scientists & staff. They have limited resources, and we as volunteers are here to support them, not the other way around.

Look, if you've got some AMD cards lying around, I can appreciate you wanting to put them to work on this project. But IMO we should all remember our role as volunteers. The AMD app will get here when it gets here. Or not. Getting in a twist and griping because your expectations aren't being met is counter-productive.

Maybe I've misinterpreted your post...if so, I apologize in advance.

Cheers!

We would like to get some alpha app for ati/amd out by the end of the year. However, we don't know if it will good enough to go in production. The update of the server has required a very large amount of work so far.

gdf

Either give your volunteers a definitive date when there will be an app, and I mean definitive, or a definitive statement 'There will never be an ATI/AMD OpenCL app for the following reasons'! But please not this "sitting between two chairs" any longer!

Please tell me you're joking.

I'm not trying to start an argument here, but I really hope that you - a VOLUNTEER - are not making demands of the GPUGRID scientists & staff. They have limited resources, and we as volunteers are here to support them, not the other way around.

Look, if you've got some AMD cards lying around, I can appreciate you wanting to put them to work on this project. But IMO we should all remember our role as volunteers. The AMD app will get here when it gets here. Or not. Getting in a twist and griping because your expectations aren't being met is counter-productive.

Maybe I've misinterpreted your post...if so, I apologize in advance.

Cheers!

No, SMTB1963, I am not joking, but I have not 'demanded' anything as well. I said 'please' as you see in the second phrase of your quoted text of mine. :)

Yes, you are right, we are the volunteers, but we are also the volunteers! :)
We support science and the scientists more or less personally with volunteering a lot of money for hardware and power. In some cases this munificence makes the science possible in the first place, and I think this is one of these cases.

I do not see myself as a 'Megacruncher', if that is a part of my statement that should have been misunderstood. But I know a lot of guys in my team and elsewhere, that could be interested in unleashing a lot of power AMD-wise (and CUDA-wise) on this project.
And it is my point of view that all volunteers deserve to be kept up to date on the progress of such undertakings on a regular basis by an official. With this kind of answer of GDF and others:

We would like to get some alpha app for ati/amd out by the end of the year. However, we don't know if it will good enough to go in production. The update of the server has required a very large amount of work so far.

gdf

I am satisfied, because it contains all the official information I waited for. First, there is an app in alpha development status, second, it could (and perhaps will) be buggy, third, the reasons that hindered the progress...

Thank you to all officials and I look forward to help (alpha- or beta-)testing the app and will continue waiting with fingers crossed.
Please continue keeping us up to date whenever you can find the time!

Cheers and sorry again, if my chose of words in English was misunderstanding, as I am German and not a native speaker!

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Seems like things have calmed down again, but I'll add some more cents anyway:

For people outside research it's sometimes difficult to imagine how it works. In reality there's no

Kirk: Scotty, how much time do you need?
Scotty: 2 Days!
Kirk: I'll give you 1!
Scotty: I'll do it in a half!

and there's always something unexpected crossing your way. The question is just how severe that is and how much effort it takes to get around it. Personally I wouldn't dare committing to a release date for a highly experimental piece of software. Well, one could release a half baked alpha in time.. but that wouldn't please people either.

And people tend to be impatient and tend to hear what they want to hear. So "we hope to get an alpha out by x" quickly turns into "Woow, there'll be an app by x!". Which is quite different..

MrS

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Seems like things have calmed down again, but I'll add some more cents anyway:

For people outside research it's sometimes difficult to imagine how it works. In reality there's no

Kirk: Scotty, how much time do you need?
Scotty: 2 Days!
Kirk: I'll give you 1!
Scotty: I'll do it in a half!

and there's always something unexpected crossing your way. The question is just how severe that is and how much effort it takes to get around it. Personally I wouldn't dare committing to a release date for a highly experimental piece of software. Well, one could release a half baked alpha in time.. but that wouldn't please people either.

And people tend to be impatient and tend to hear what they want to hear. So "we hope to get an alpha out by x" quickly turns into "Woow, there'll be an app by x!". Which is quite different..

MrS

My Genealogy software did exactly that, they gave a hoped for release date and then caught holy he!! for missing it. They came on and gave the reasons for the delay and it did not help!! They now say it will be relased when it is ready and not before, they still catch some flak but not nearly as much!!

For people outside research it's sometimes difficult to imagine how it works... [beamed Kirk & Scotty out of quote] ...there's always something unexpected crossing your way. The question is just how severe that is and how much effort it takes to get around it. Personally I wouldn't dare committing to a release date for a highly experimental piece of software. Well, one could release a half baked alpha in time.. but that wouldn't please people either.

And people tend to be impatient and tend to hear what they want to hear. So "we hope to get an alpha out by x" quickly turns into "Woow, there'll be an app by x!". Which is quite different..

MrS

Hmmm, This sounds a lot like software development at work. Oh, wait, this IS software development! Just not at work. ;-) LOL

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Oh, wait, this IS software development! Just not at work. ;-) LOL

Not your work :D

MrS

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Scanning for our furry friends since Jan 2002

Oh, wait, this IS software development! Just not at work. ;-) LOL

Not your work :D

MrS

ROFLMAO... Excellent point!

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- da shu @ HeliOS,
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HI,
GCN is the suggested core for GPUGRID, its performance should rival Nvidia cores.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-HD-7900-XDR2-Rambus-Memory,13408.html

gdf

HI,
GCN is the suggested core for GPUGRID, its performance should rival Nvidia cores.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-HD-7900-XDR2-Rambus-Memory,13408.html

gdf

In an older post you said that the amd app should support OpenCL 1.0, meaning 4xxx series and up.
Are you trying to say that the 2 previous architectures will be abandoned?

We don't know yet, but we will start testing on GCN cards and initially support those. I am expecting enough problems already with a single compiler generation.

gdf

We don't know yet, but we will start testing on GCN cards and initially support those. I am expecting enough problems already with a single compiler generation.

gdf

If this is the best answer after 2 years of waiting, to support an architecture that it's not even out yet, then ... good luck with all that